Author Topic: Other People Are People? (Read 962 times)

Bellerophon · « **on:** November 18, 2013, 02:21:08 PM »

I've noticed a lot of people seem upset when other, more privileged people, pose hypothetical questions about whether they should be allowed to exist. Or whether they should have the same rights as privileged people. Or whether they are entitled to the same levels of dignity and respect by virtue of being human that are afforded to other, more privileged groups.

Why is that? Why are so many people offended by being used as debate props for the amusement of people who don't struggle with oppression on the axis used for debate? Why do people in marginalized groups hate fun and intellectual debate?

Cobalt · « **Reply #1 on:** November 18, 2013, 02:26:20 PM »

We actually don't hate anything. We have no thoughts or feelings or opinions. We are P-zombies, only loosely classifiable as living creatures at all.

Now you know everything; now there are no more secrets.

Danelly · « **Reply #2 on:** November 18, 2013, 02:29:27 PM »

I don't know about you, but I just don't like being treated like specimen in a petri dish.

I'm a person. Talk to me. Love me. Hate me. Don't study me, don't debate whether I am natural or dangerous or against whatever belief system you follow.

Even if to you I seem like an amoeba or something, love me. Love the amoeba.

Ruffian · « **Reply #3 on:** November 18, 2013, 04:39:12 PM »

god

On a side note I was talking to a person about this today after that ONE TOPIC we all saw and I was just like,

"Okay from now on pretend every debate topic about LGBQT* you make is actually about African Americans. Would this be an okay topic if it were about African Americans? If the answer is NO, you might be better off not making this topic. If it's a terrible thing to say about a racial minority, it is probably a terrible thing to say about LGBQT* people."

It sucks to have to simplify things that hard, but it was the only way I could think of to explain it?

sorry to serious this up but IS THERE A BETTER WAY TO EXPLAIN IT THAT THEY WILL IMMEDIATELY GET? I hate having to draw parallels to other marginalized groups all the time but sometimes the emotional impact doesn't really translate until I do.

Cobalt · « **Reply #4 on:** November 18, 2013, 04:41:20 PM »

That sucks. I've had to do it the other way around, when I've been places where lots of people were white LGBT folks but racist like a really racist thing. I had to be like, "Look. You would never let anybody say that about bisexual people. I need you to not be okay with POC getting discussed that way either."

It's always hella disappointing when people who oughtta know better just sort of... space out on a particular issue and fail to apply the same reasoning to it that they do elsewhere. It is very frustrating.

Bellerophon · « **Reply #5 on:** November 18, 2013, 04:48:50 PM »

Quote from: Ruffian on November 18, 2013, 04:39:12 PM

god

On a side note I was talking to a person about this today after that ONE TOPIC we all saw and I was just like,

"Okay from now on pretend every debate topic about LGBQT* you make is actually about African Americans. Would this be an okay topic if it were about African Americans? If the answer is NO, you might be better off not making this topic. If it's a terrible thing to say about a racial minority, it is probably a terrible thing to say about LGBQT* people."

It sucks to have to simplify things that hard, but it was the only way I could think of to explain it?

sorry to serious this up but IS THERE A BETTER WAY TO EXPLAIN IT THAT THEY WILL IMMEDIATELY GET? I hate having to draw parallels to other marginalized groups all the time but sometimes the emotional impact doesn't really translate until I do.

Unfortunately, in my experience, humans are very good at understanding analogies that would apply to them and are not as good at immediately extending empathy and consideration to people that are different from them in some way. So, while it's not ideal to draw parallels to other marginalized groups, it is effective, and it's more effective than picking something that is not a source of oppression. Since, to quote that thread, "blue eyes" is not a source of oppression, although it is a minority and mutant trait.

Some day, this will not be necessary. Some day.

Ruffian · « **Reply #6 on:** November 18, 2013, 04:58:38 PM »

One glorious day!

It's weird the kind of blind spots people have. I mean, I'm not without my own blindspots -- there is something, somewhere, that I'm uneducated on and am ignorant about, and probably I will say something super ignorant and offensive and I will be corrected. I know that this is true.

But it's weird when the blind spot is like a HUGE THING -- like racism. I'm always like HOW ARE YOU STILL S:LDKGJDS:LKGJSD AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH